Forum: EasyBoot
Topic: USB start kit (EasyBoot)
started by: balder
Posted by balder on Oct. 22 2008,15:01
Hello EasyBoot friends!

First I would like to say thank you to the brilliant heureka that made it possible to start and run EasyBoot from USB devices. Thank you heureka!

Secondly I have put together an “easy to get starting kit” and made it downloadable from my site here: < http://web.telia.com/~u75404714/balder.html > Download and enjoy.

Thank you to xoben and the EasyBoot development team for this lovely program/utility that now can boot from USB devices as well!

The future is already here!

Best wishes from balder
Posted by Orochi on Aug. 28 2009,19:50
balder,

I read your instructions found here < http://web.telia.com/~u75404714/instruction.html >
but for some reason I don't get the same results.

When i double click on winbuilder a Download Centre window comes up. If I close that window then I see the script tab but everything else is blank, there is no USB-Easyboot-script like on your picture.

Thanks.
Posted by balder on Aug. 29 2009,06:35
@Orochi

Welcome to this forum Orochi :)

I’m sorry to announce that I at present time am in a bit of hurry (bought a new house=plenty much to do) :p

Some notes…
When you run EasyBoot from USB, most applications is not launched in the “EasyBoot traditionally way”. Some applications runs (started as usual using “run XXX.ima”). Plenty of “old” floppy images like Ghost, pqmagic.IMA, acroima9.ima etcetera can be launched as usual. Note: acronis products started using an upsized floppy image, seems to run well.

I do have in position several brand new updated USB-EasyBoot-scripts developed by me to offer you (free of charge of course, but – as usual - used at your own risk).
Download number one from < here > (please read instructions "If you not are familiar with Winbuilder" how to start script before downloading)

Linux applications can mostly be launched using EasyBoot on USB device. But not in that traditionally way. I instead use “kicker.images” (floppy image whit grub loader that launch ISO;s). Example: I have SLAX on my USB stick, runs like a dream.

Another interesting development is possibility to activate USB-2 in “BIOS-mode”. Some computers (motherboards), at least some new ones automatically use USB-2 already in “BIOS-mode”, but some not (especially those used some years). I can activate USB-2 (launched by a kicker-image from EasyBoot on USB-device) witch heavily increase read speed from USB-device. Maybe not always necessary - but still useful. I can tell you later about this part.

Note: I’m heavily occupied ???  at present time (need some days to work on the house before I have time to give you some more information. Let’s say a day or two…). In meantime, please test script and tell me how it works.

Attention: Download updated 17:03

Regards balder

Posted by madar on Aug. 29 2009,14:38
Hi Dear balder
Thanks a lot . Realy very nice work
Posted by Orochi on Aug. 29 2009,16:51
balder thank you for your response.
[QUOTE]need some days to work on the house before I have time to give you some more information[CODE]
I am of course prepared to wait as long as needed. Take your, time by all means. :)

I am not familiar with Winbuilder at all. When i execute winbuilder.exe I get ths screen.
I guess in your instructions you skip few steps as you probably assume that most people are familiar with that application.
I would really appreciate if you could dissect for me the exact process of how to use your script.

Meanwhile I tired using the USB+EZboot tutorial
< http://www.ezbsystems.com/cgi-bin....;hl=usb >
and I had some success. The USB was able to boot to EZboot menu and I could even Launch Acronis and few dos based IMA files. I was, however, unable to launch any of the programs that depend on the linux kernel, like Paragon and Hiren BootCD 9.9.

If you know how to fix this problem with linux based applications under EZboot on USB I would really appreciate it.
Posted by balder on Aug. 29 2009,17:05
@Oroch

Quote: ” I am not familiar with Winbuilder at all”

1. Delete you present folder winbuilder.
2. Please read instructions < here >
3. Do a completely new download as well from < here > when you have read instructions
4. WHEN YOU HAVE LAUNCHED WINBUILDER, DO NOT PUSH ON DOWNLOAD BUTTON IN THE UPPER RIGHT CORNER  :O

I’m sure you soon can handle situation to the best :D

Regards balder
Posted by Orochi on Aug. 29 2009,17:59
balder I beg your pardon. My total commander winrar unpack script was messing with me. Every time
I unpacked your zip file I was losing the folder structure. I can see similar windows now.

I will test your script when i come back home from work.

Thank you so much for your help.

Posted by Orochi on Aug. 30 2009,00:09
balder, Hello again :)

I tried running your script at home. It seems like it is doing what needs to be done. However I did not have any success with actually booting with USB.

I tired one stick which is 1GB, the computer simply bypasses the USB like there is nothing.
I also tried 4GB stick, the computer gives me this error upon boot. "Remove disks or other media Press key to restart"

Hopefully you will be able what's wrong.

Best Regards :)
Posted by balder on Aug. 30 2009,02:48
@Orochi

quote: "Remove disks or other media Press key to restart" This most likely indicates that no boot record is present on USB device. BIOS can’t find such (USB device).

1. A god start is to check what BIOS has found. Go into BIOS when rebooting and se if BIOS can find USB device. And then of course set USB device to be the number one of boot devices.

2. Did you test checking “Repair BOOT-record during process Note: Best working in 32-bit systems”?

Note: script only uses fast format as default. I have no problem using 4 different USB sticks. I can also use hard disk unit connected via USB cable without problems :)

This is most likely related to how your USB devices (thumb drive/stick?) earlier have been formatted. You can also test doing a full format in Windows. Right click on your USB device and choose to format (choose full format FAT32). Then run script as usual.

Regards balder

Posted by Orochi on Aug. 30 2009,16:57
balder thank your for response :)

The USB boot is set properly. It is the first device and is identified in my bios are "removable".
The reason I know it is set right is because I already managed to boot from usb by doing heureka's tutorial.

It could be that you script uses quick format, however I discovered that heureka uses NTFS format while your script is performing FAT32 format.  

I also tried with and without the “Repair BOOT-record during process Note: Best working in 32-bit systems” feature.

When I come home I will try to do a long format FAT32 using HP tool for windows.

I will let you know if it worked.

In your script it states that the USB sticks that could be used are only up to 2GB, is it true? Have you tried using larger USB ticks ?

Thank you for your time :)
Posted by balder on Aug. 31 2009,03:07
@Orochi

Well in script I state, and I quote: “Script support USB Stick\Thumb drives up to 2048 GB in size”. So size is no problem. I can of course change to full format (no big deal).

Note: I (and related friends) is using this kind of script with success, but it’s been reported from other forums that some odd motherboards behave “bad” in this matter.

When script is finished you are offered to test your USB device in qemu. Does it boot in this test bench? If so, script works properly and this problem is related to your motherboard. Please check this last point.

Regards balder
Posted by Orochi on Aug. 31 2009,15:13
All right after few test still doesn't work.
I formatted the stick using full format FAT32 then used your script - get same result.
qemu doesn't work for me either.

I will try a bit more when i get back home.
Posted by balder on Aug. 31 2009,17:02
@Orochi

Okay, you can always run HP-format-tool to completely wipe out USB device and then run script. Seems that boot-record can’t be found on USB device.

I must say that this is very odd ???

Regards balder
Posted by Orochi on Sep. 01 2009,01:51
Hi balder,

Nope, same negative results with your script. :(

I might try your script on one more USB stick and then I give up...
Posted by balder on Sep. 01 2009,14:19
@Oroch

To figure out what causing “boot”-problems to your USB-device when using script instead of the “manually” way, I suggest that you after using script (finding that USB-device can’t boot) only manually inject grub boot-sector using grubinst_gui.exe that you already are acquainted with. Then run boot-device using built-in qemu test in script (do not run script, only use test facility in script). If Boot-device boot and run at this point, we know what causing your problems.

Please note that I am very grateful if you can test this to figure out if there is a bug in script – and if so – where bug is in script. However, I must point out that script been used in plenty of computer (stationary as laptops) without problems ???

Regards from a grateful :cool:  balder
Posted by madar on Sep. 01 2009,17:32
Hi dear balder
A few days ago i have seen this topic of you and i have got so happy that you have done this nice work.
but now that i got time to test it,i can not run that successfully.
it formats then asks where is the iso and after giving the address of iso it copies the files then when trying to test failes

would you give us step by step proccess of doing job?
i have spent about 3 hours by 4G flash drive but no success
thanks
Posted by balder on Sep. 01 2009,17:50
@madar

Thanks for respons :)

Please read basic procedure < here >. Download Grub MBR-tool < here > (read in basic procedure how to use it) and inject manually grub boot-sector after running script (seems that boot-sector is not injected properly therefore let script do it things and manually inject boot-sector using grub MBR-tool).

So, I suggest that you after using script (finding that USB-device can’t boot) only manually inject grub boot-sector using grubinst_gui.exe
Then run boot-device using built-in qemu test in script (do not run script, only use test facility in script).

It could be of important how you expand downloaded zip-file as I use built-in zip in totalcommander. Maybe its here the problem is ???

balder
Posted by Orochi on Sep. 02 2009,01:13
Hello balder  :)

Thank your for taking time from your life to help us out with your script.
I did some tetsing on my friend's PC and it worked.

I didn't have to run the script again on his PC, I simply used the same usb created on my PC and tested its on his.

Since he doesn't have front (case) usb ports hooked into his motherboard, I had to use the back usb ports. And it seemd to work.

And you were right  :), Paragon and Linux stuff ran with no problems.
I only had a problem with Hiren BootCD 9.9. It is also linux based.
Hiren would launch fine and then show the first menu with options; however, once one choses any option from that visible menu the screen goes black.
Would you be able to look into it.

I will come home and test the usb on my PC using the back usb ports. If I am not successfull, I will try your method with manual injection that you are suggesting.
Posted by balder on Sep. 02 2009,04:56
@Orochi

Quote: “I did some testing on my friend's PC and it worked.”

Hmm ???  peculiar behaviour :O

You have to give me at least 6 hours (occupied you now).
I do have a solution concerning hiren boot-cd.

Most grateful again for your patience :cool:

Edit: I have created a set of “kick”-images to be used primary for USB-loading. Please download zip-file from < here >
When downloaded extract and copy files to folder ezboot.

To boot to winXP-systems on hard disk use command:
memdisk STARTXP.IMA.GZ

To boot to vista-systems on hard disk use command:
memdisk runvista.ima.gz

To reboot computer use command:
memdisk REBOOT.IMA.GZ

To shutdown computer use command:
memdisk SHUTDOWN.IMA.GZ

How to launch hiren boot-cd and slax read below.

Run slax from USB launched by EasyBoot.

How to launch slax from USB using EasyBoot as boot-manager:

Download iso-version of slax from here < http://www.slax.org/get_slax.php?download=iso > (DO NOT download slax for USB)

Open slax-iso with your favourite program (I use Ultra-ISO). Extract folder slax to some temporary folder (or your archive for this purpose - to be used in future – and not only just this time). We are later going to copy this folder slax to USB-device).
Now delete folder slax in ISO-file (we don’t need folder slax inside ISO-file anymore). Save reduced ISO with the new name slax.iso to your archive for future use. Note: make sure you use name slax.iso

In EasyBoot menu use command:  memdisk SLAX.IMG.GZ
Create your EasyBoot ISO and then run winbuilder (let script do it’s things with USB-device). Choose your newly created EasyBoot ISO-file when script asks for iso-file.

Copy reduced slax-ISO from your archive to folder ISO on USB-device and finally copy folder slax from your archive to USB device (note: to the root of USB device and not in any folder).

That’s it! In slax meny, choose to run slax from RAM (recommended).

How to boot hiren_9.9-iso from USB launched by EasyBoot.

You can use my “kicker”-image to launch Hiren 9.9.iso

In EasyBoot menu use command:  memdisk hiren.img.gz
Create your EasyBoot ISO and then run winbuilder (let script do it’s things with USB-device). Choose your newly created EasyBoot ISO-file when script asks for iso-file.

Copy your downloaded hiren ISO-file to folder ISO on USB-device. Rename hiren ISO-file to hiren.iso   Make sure you use name  hiren.iso

Attention! It’s important that you rerun winbuilder-script each time you make changes on USB-device. If you use such USB-device that hasn’t been “refreshed” (formatted) you can get this error:
“Error 60: File for drive emulation must be in one contiguous disk area” This is typical for a fragmented USB-device.
Note: It’s possible to load and run ISO-files from RAM, but as major of motherboards at present time only support USB-1-speed this is not a god idea. Okay you can load USB-2-speed using plop but then we get new problems (interferences between USB-drivers).
This last point is something to discuss later. Concentrate on hiren, slax etcetera for now.

To be more productive you can create a “final” EasyBoot ISO-file and use this in script and finally copy everything else to USB-device continuously (read example above, that will say: copy hiren and copy slax and what more you later want to have on USB-device)

Edit 2: Script updated (latest grub file included + full format including using RMPartUSB.exe as format tool to USB-stick/thumbdriver) Download from website < here >

Have fun…


Regards balder

Posted by Orochi on Sep. 02 2009,23:22
Hi balder,
Thank you again for the info.

After I came home, I tested USB created with your script that I was able to run on my friend's computer.
Turns out the USB booted fine when being connected to the back of the case. If i connect usb into the ports on the front of my case then the usb would not boot. :(
I hope that this can be fixed somehow as I find it very inconvenient to connect my usb to the back of the case.

About Hiren, for some reason it worked somewhat fine. I mean was able to see main menu and all the submenus and I was even able to launch few programs. However I encountered a different error with Hiren. after I quit an application, Hiren tries to load SmartDRV and seems to be stuck at this point. So it never goes back to the menu.

Thank You for the new script with a Full format. I will give it a try. I think i am making a progress :D.
It is difficult to imagine that USB boot could be so picky, I mean BootCDs work like a charm. Oh well ;)

I will try some of the things you mentioned with hiren a bit later.

Thank you again ;)

Best Regards.
Posted by balder on Sep. 03 2009,02:33
@Orochi

Quote: ” It is difficult to imagine that USB boot could be so picky,”

Well this is more related to what motherboard in conjunction whit what BIOS that is used ???
There is no “universal” solution as there are so many different hardware/BIOS - there is the same amount of  “problems” :(

About hiren: I can report that this behaviour is “nearly” common. If you test your USB device on some other computer (with different motherboard/BIOS) hiren might work perfect.  
Why USB boot doesn’t work sometimes when connected to front end, I can’t tell. But as you pointed out, test new script and see what happens. Secondly, do the whole thing manually and se if it works (booting from front end with hiren on USB).

In my opinion this kind of problems is hardware/BIOS related. It’s been reported that if modifying USB-stick/thumbdrive to be more like a “fixed disk”, bootability increases.
I’m not using this at this point, as I never experience this kind of problems thought I have tested my USB devices (several different types) on so many computers (including laptops) without boot problems.

Well let’s see what you find out – had to go :p

Regards balder
Posted by Orochi on Sep. 03 2009,18:20
Hello balder ;)

Thank you for the information. If you get a chance could you test if your USB boots from the front USB ports. If I get a chance I am gonna test this with other computers that had front USB ports connected into the motherboard.
You said Laptops work fine, this is because their USB ports are done the same way as the back ports
on my PC, you basically plug your sub straight into the motherboard.

QUOTE
modifying USB-stick/thumbdrive to be more like a “fixed disk”, bootability increases

Is this achieved with a basic defragmenter ? Or are you talking about something else.

Thanks and Take Care...
Posted by balder on Sep. 04 2009,03:10
@Orochi

I always use my front end (he, he lazy as I am :p ) and this works fine in several of those computers (friends and the same to those on my work). Front end USB connector are as you point out, not directly connected to motherboard as back end connector are.

Quote. “Is this achieved with a basic defragmenter ?”

I simply use built-in zip-function in program totalcommander (wincommander) and have never had any problem with this solution.

Again have to rush (wife is now ready before me – very uncommon :;):  )

Regards balder
Posted by Orochi on Sep. 04 2009,20:44
If I chose to cancel format the USB in your script, will the script continue to run fine?

Take Care ;)

PS: I think I answered my own question by trying this out. :p

Posted by Orochi on Sep. 05 2009,00:03
I believe I answered my own question.

Finally, very good news. The updated script with a full format finally made the USB bootable :D

Hiren BootCD works fine so as other linux programs.

Few things that I noticed:

1. I did not select "Repair boot during process" it was not selected by default.
2. It seems, unless it is my imagination, that USB ran much longer to load Linux based paragon than a CD.
3. Tried using the USB 2.o support feature but it seems like plpbt.bin was loading forever.
4. With hiren I did not notice any problems yet but than I again I tested it only for 5min because I was so happy to run back here and share my joy :)
5. Very important, the USB was able to boot from the front USB ports  :cool:

Now questions.
During the process of the script one has to select ISO. Does it have to be iso made with EZboot or can it be any iso with a boot ability?

Can I hide all the files and folders related to the boot and fill the rest of the USB with files I use on regular bases?


Once again thank you so much for your script - genius at work :)

Take Care...

Posted by balder on Sep. 06 2009,02:21
@Orochi

Quote:

“1. I did not select "Repair boot during process" it was not selected by default.”
It’s not selected as default, as this normally shouldn’t be needed to use. It happens that USB devices “go nuts” and boot sector is “twisted up” :p  this is where "Repair boot during process" comes in handy.

”2. It seems, unless it is my imagination, that USB ran much longer to load Linux based paragon than a CD.”
Yes this is normal, if your motherboard doesn’t support USB-2.0 during boot. But some Linux developments loads there own USB-2.0 drivers when the initiate period is done (Slax is such a system)

”3. Tried using the USB 2.o support feature but it seems like plpbt.bin was loading forever.”
As I earlier corresponded, sometimes hardware (motherboard/BIOS/chip) doesn’t behave as expected. Note: This option is only to be used as the “last way out” to load USB-2.0 drivers. If your motherboard already support USB-2.0, it’s no use at all. Note: you cannot use this option when running script and using built-in test facility (run script/USB in qemu). Only to be used when restarting computer (new boot).

”4. With hiren I did not notice any problems yet but than I again I tested it only for 5min because I was so happy to run back here and share my joy.”
It should be working fine. Note: some programs even stall (hooks up) when I run hiren from CD, again compatibility problems according to different motherboard/BIOS/chip

“5. Very important, the USB was able to boot from the front USB ports”
Well, what can I say? I have always used built-in format tool in windows and have never had any boot problems using that. But I’m most grateful that you found this problem, so I could modify script to be a little bit better, thank you :)

“During the process of the script one has to select ISO. Does it have to be iso made with EZboot or can it be any iso with a boot ability?”
As stated in Help, you can use any ISO or single floppy image that is bootable using grub. Witch basically means every floppy image and a lot of ISO-files as well.
Note: Not some ISO-files cannot be launched this way (Slax is a problem) but hiren works fine. But again, a lot of ISO-files surely can be launched this way. Test for your self :)

“Can I hide all the files and folders related to the boot and fill the rest of the USB with files I use on regular bases?”
Well, ISO-file created by EasyBoot can hide its internal files and folders completely. To hide files and folders on USB should be possible (I guess, but not 100% sure). You can of course use right mouse button and choose to hide every file and folder separately. Bu if you want/need a “completely hide” of files and folders on the USB root, I think you need some external software to achieve this. I really haven’t been thinking on this, but it sounds as a good idea. When I do have more time, I’ll take a look into it.

“Once again thank you so much for your script - genius at work”
He, he this was the best part :D

Regards and take care your self

balder
Posted by Orochi on Sep. 06 2009,12:44
Thank your for your response balder :)

I have few updates/comments:

1. I managed to put other files on the USB together with the boot essential files. After all, this is 4GB USB, I still want to use it as I normally use it in windows. USB was able to successfully boot together with extra files.
The next step I want to do is hide all the files relates to usb boot processes using total commander change attributes function. I will let you know how this went ;)

2. It appears that my BIOS on my Asus M2N-Sli Deluxe detects USB stick as one of the hard drives rather than a removable hardware. this creates a lot of problems for me.
For Example the boot sequence is: Removable
                                                       CDROM
                                                       HDD
                                                       Nothing
However, since my usb stick (I tried other usb sticks as well) seen by my bios as HDDs, I have to go into my bios each time and set in the HDD menu that USB will be the first HDD to boot. By default when USB is detected in bios it is always set as a last HDD to boot. So this means that my SATA hdd with windows will always boot before my USB unless I go into the bios each time and manually set the USB stick to be the first one to boot.
I have no idea how to fix this issues.
Perhaps if there was a key to skip boot on my windows HDD so it can go to the last HDD which is by default is a USB stick then it might work.

Once again thank you for your knowledge and expertise in this field. :)
Much appreciated. :D

Take Care...
Posted by Orochi on Sep. 13 2009,14:19
Did some more tests.

It is indeed possible to change the attributes of files related to the USB boot processes without disrupting the operation itself.
My USB stick is 4GB, the files that have to do with actual boot processes take not more than 500megs. I was able to hide and set them to be read only under windows and the USB was still able to boot into Grub.

Thank your so much for your script balder . :D You are amazing !!! :)